Cracking the Smith Code - DRAFT

For the purposes of Smith family history research we are looking at the period between 1791 when Lucy Smith was born and 1820 when her son Robert Smith was born at Bradfield, Berkshire, England. 

At the time, the Burghfield Manor House was owned by the Earl of Shrewsbury.  His name was Henry John Chetwynd-Talbot (8 November 1803 - 4 June 1868) and he was the Lord of the Manor.

Henry John Chetwynd-Talbot, James Cecil's cousin's son

The Burghfield Manor House “The Old Manor” is found on Folly Lane, Burghfield, SU 66 NE (north west side). Trash Green 4/10 The Old Manor II Small Manor, now house. It is 2.5km from the Theale Train Station. This house was built in 1685 and is now known as The Old Manor, Whitehousegreen, Sulhamstead even though it lies within the Burghfield Parish. It’s not marked as a manor house in the Ordinance Survey but as a small plot.  The Historic England Archive holds a buildings file collected by the National Monuments Record for 'The Old Manor' in Burghfield with sale particulars and other material. This house is not to be confused by the house near the church called “The Manor House”

NOTE: Folly Lane runs into the Sulhamstead Abbots Church road. Very close to Sulhamstead Abbots.

The manor was settled on John Talbot, the nephew and heir of the Earl of Shrewsbury, who inherited in 1630.

Description: Brick with virteous headers, old tile gabled roof. 3 cell lobby entrance plan with stair turret and C20 exgtensions at rear. 2 storeys and attics, attic window on gable is blocked. Central chimney on ridge.

Below is a photo of the Burghfield Manor House.

1791 - Lucy Smith born

1819 - Robert conceived and Lucy Smith working at Burghfield Manor House as a parlour maid.

9 Jan 1820 - Robert Smith born

The estate was bought from the Earl of Shrewsbury by the Thoyts family after 1852, and was sold by Col. N. B. Thoyts to Sir William G. Watson in 1910.

HOW THIS LINKS IN WITH THE SMITHS

In my opinion Lucy Smith became pregnant by James Brownlow William Gascoyne Cecil, Henry's cousin's son.

James Brownlow William Gascoyne Cecil
(17 Apr 1791 - 12 April 1868)

Both he and Lucy would have been 28 at the time of conception.

How this all relates to Horace's interview from the 1970's

G. Why was Henry deported?
H. Henry was deported for killing a rabbit.  A keeper caught Henry killing the rabbit.  The keeper claimed Henry had stolen the rabbit from another property.  Now he didn't do that.  You see, the rabbit used to come across the road from another property to his own property, go through the wire-netting and eat his cabbages, carrots and lettuces, so Henry set a snare, a wire snare, and he caught it.  The keeper caught him.  The keeper said he stole a rabbit from the Manor House.  His deportation was arranged for stealing a rabbit from another property.

[The Lord of the Manor at Burghfield at the time of the supposed rabbit episode was the Earl of Shrewsbury. 
He owned BURGHFIELD MANOR HOUSE.
His name was HENRY JOHN CHETWYND-TALBOT.]

G.  This was a big charge in those days.  Who really pushed the charge?
H. Lord Burghley was away and when he came back he heard about it and wouldn't allow it.  He arrange for a pardon but Henry said he was going to Australia, he wouldn't give in.  Lord Burghley paid his fare out here I think and gave him money for when he landed here.

G. In other words, he wasn't deported?
H. No. He was never deported, he came out with freedom. 

[Proved: Henry came out under the Government scheme on board the "Adamant" with his new wife Susannah on 18 July 1865.  He was not deported. He arrived in Australia on 15 October 1865]

G. He was on his way anyway so Lord Burghley paid his fare out here?
H. Yes. He was cleared of the case; he could have stopped in England, but he wanted to go to Australia.

G.  We heard that it was Henry's grandmother or mother who pushed the case.
H.  She pushed it to Lord Burghley.
A. She wanted to get rid of him.
H. No. She wanted him to stay.

G. What did your late son Eddie see when he visited the old house at Burghfield Common near Reading?

[Edward Charles "Eddie" Smith was Horace's born in Gawler, South Australia in 1924 and died in Ballarat, Victoria in 1955. He was in WW2 RAAF - enlisted 12 January 1943 and discharged 29 January 1946.  I'm making an assumption here but perhaps he visited Burghfield Common during his WW2 deployment (1943 to 1946). General train stations at that time were Mortimer and Sulhamstead Abbotts.]

H. He got off a train and asked where to go, where the Manor House was, where the Smith-Burghley's lived.  The Stationmaster said straight through there, but you can't go through it.  Eddie said "How did the fellow get the Manor House?", and the Stationmaster said, "He fought for it".  Eddie said "Then he'll have to fight me for it".  Anyway, he went there and when he told them who he was, they got out a horse and coach for him.  They gave him the red carpet treatment.  Their name was SCRIVEN. 

 [I have found a GEORGE SMITH marrying a SARAH SCRIVEN on 5 September 1803 at Thatcham, Berkshire, England].

[There were also SCRIBBANS in Bradfield. The only evidence of found of Burghleys is that Bucklebury in Bradfield used to be called Burghulbury]

G. That house used to be owned by the Smith-Burghleys?
E. Yes.

G. Well, how come the Scrivens have it now?
H. Well, he married a Smith-Burghley.

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G. Now Robert was your grandfather, Joseph's father, you probably never met him.
H. Robert never came out from England.

[Proved correct].

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G. Who did he marry and did he marry only once?
H. He married only once. [Proved correct].  His wife lived for a long time after he died. [Robert died 1895, his wife Lucy died 1900] I am trying to think of girl's name who looked after her.  My dad [Joseph] wanted to pay her for what she did (the girl).  He wanted her to come out to Australia, but she never came.

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G. You said before that a Smith married into the family somewhere, before Robert, whereabouts?
H. That was father's grandfather.

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G. In other words, Robert's father?
H. Yes. He married a Smith.  It was found out later that the "Smith" was high up in society than the Burghleys were.  She was related to some "Lord" or something.  She was tossed out.  I don't know what her father did wrong.

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G. Why do you think they took the name Smith-Burghley.  As recognition of this or what?

[Never found any reference to Smith-Burghley in records.  Only thing close is an Edward Burley-Smith (aged 27), a shorthand writer, who married Lucy Cordelia Robinson (aged 22) at Poplar, London whose father is Samuel Burley-Smith, a Baker. Edward was living at 29 Albion Road, Dalston and Lucy was at 530 Grosvenor Buildings.  Her father was Albert Robinson, an architect. It is the only time records show these names.

Also found quite a few Burley-Smith's in America.

There are however, many with the last name Robert or Roberts.]

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 H. My grandfather [Robert] should have been Lord Burghley.  He was the eldest in the family, but the second son took it on.  They took the name Smith-Burghley.  They name the first son Smith-Burghley.

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G. Do you know his Christian name?
H. No. I was away from the age of 15 years to 21 years and I never knew much about that.

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G. So those years when you could have been interested you were not home!  Did the family talk much about the background?
H.  Ern used to fish things.

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G. Where do you think the disinheritance occurred?
H. Robert's father.

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G. Why did it occur?
H. Because he married a Smith.
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G. Did Albert live in the Burghley Common area?
 H. He lived in one of the farms around the Manor House.  He used to carry the mail for the Post Office when he got caught in the snow.  He was never any good after.

[One of Robert's son was named Charles Henry Smith who died at age 21 and never moved out of home. Could this be him?].

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G. A Lord Burghley visited Australia around about the first World War and Henry presented him with a walking stick. Is that right?
H. That's correct.

[Lord Salisbury, James Cecil's son visited Adelaide between 1852.]

"As a young man of 22, Lord Robert Cecil who afterwards, as Lord Salisbury, was Prime Minister of Great Britain, in the year 1852 came to Australia in the barque Amazon, and visited the goldfields of Bendigo.  He kept a diary, which, preserved at Hatfield among many important historic documents, was made available for publication by the courtesy of the present Marquis of Salisbury"......."On his way to Victoria, Lord Robert spent some weeks in South Australia.  Adelaide he found drained of its population by the rush to the diggings: the revenue of the province had almost vanished owing to the fall of the Customs receipts to zero; and the land was unsaleable, one property on which 1,500 pounds had been spent having been sold for 43 pounds.  In February Lord Robert visited the Burra cooper mine, where he was particularly impressed by "the beautiful colour of the malachite". The Advertiser 5 Oct 1935.
The Advertiser also published this:

"Lord Robert Cecil arrived in Australia in the ship Amazon on January 30, 1852.  He landed at Port Adelaide "where we heard from the post master that gold has been discovered at Melbourne, and that Adelaide has been gradually drained of its population by the mania which the news had raised".  He walked two miles over a sandy peninsula, broiling hot, and then was driven in a cart about eight miles in Adelaide city. "In consequence of the emigration mania, excited by the discovery of the goldfields, the colonial revenue has for the time almost vanished....

On February 16 he visited the Burra copper mine. "On arriving we went to the hotel, where we found the landlord and landlady on the point of starting for the diggings".  He was shown all over the mine, admiring especially "the beautiful colour of the malachite".  The captain of the ship was unable to sail for Melbourne for a fortnight after the due date because four of his crew had deserted.  But the Amazon put to sea on March 14, and reached Melbourne on March 24."

He was a guest of Mr Frederick Hansbrow Dutton at Anlady and Mr Francis Stacker Dutton (first Agent General for South Australia at Kapunda. Robert also visited Castlemaine, Victoria, Melbourne, Tasmania, New South Wales and New Zealand.

Henry Smith arrived in 1875.  Did Robert tell Henry about his visit to Adelaide in 1852?]

Robert died in 1903 so it wasn't him that visited during WW1. Was it his son William?

James Cecil's son Robert Arthur Talbot Gascoyne Cecil (1830-1903). My father is the spitting image.

G. Do you remember where he stopped in Adelaide?
H. No.


G. Did you ever meet him?
 H. No. This was when I was up north.  Edie might know.

[Edward Charles Smith his son, died in 1955!]


G. Did the family put on a show for him?
 H. Not as far as I know.  There was a Lord Burghley two years ago came looking for his relations.  He was thrown off a horse and broke his neck (In Queensland).

[In 1953 Lord Burghley's relative Lady Violet Dorothea Bromley-Wilson died in Queensland]

[Never found any evidence of a Lord Burghley being thrown off a horse and breaking his neck. In 1939 he fell off his horse in England and broke a tendon in his heel. In 1939 Lady Burghley fell off her horse in England and broke a collar bone.]



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G. Did this earlier chap visit Leicester Street?
H. I don't know.  I wasn't home at the time.  Ruby used to have a lot of papers, I don't know if she has them now.

DORIS EDWARDS EXPLAINS THAT SHE LOOKS AFTER RUBY'S POSSESSIONS AND THAT THEY ARE NOT THERE.

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G. He disowned them?

H. Well, he did and he didn't, but when I was born [1887] a Joseph Burghley was a minister who left a house and he was a godfather to Joseph (Horace's father). 

He called him Jerry.  He sent a gold watch from England for Joseph and the Reverend Erskine [Eliza was working for a Reverend Erskine in English Census of 1871]  who married a Smith-Burghley wrote to Mum and told her to call me Horace.

[Incorrect - Reverend Thomas Erskine married Emmeline Augusta Adeane on 8 April 1856]

HARD TO UNDERSTAND - REFERS TO GODPARENTS.

The Reverend Joseph Burghley became Bishop of Berkshire.

G. Was he related to the family?
H. I think  so.  He was a Burghley.  After Mum died, the church lent no hand to the family.  The Reverend McCullogh (Spelling?) from the Baptist Union came around and did all sorts of things for us.  That's when Dad joined the Baptists.

[What I did find is James Cecil's grandson was William Rupert Ernest Gascoyne Cecil.  He was the Bishop of Exeter.]


William Rupert Ernest Gascoyne Cecil (1863-1936)





In later years

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G. Can you remember anything about a pantrymaid or a kitchenmaid or parlourmaid?

H. Annie was a pantrymaid in England.  Grandma Dore was a parlourmaid or kitchenmaid.

[Yes, Lucy Dore was a parlourmaid in Reading]

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More on Burghfield Manor





The Burghfield Estates were sold in 1870, two years after John Henry Chetwynd-Talbot died.


Sold again in 1918.